Talk:Santoor

Liner notes?

Santoor has nothing Semitic in it. It is an Aryan instrument indigenous to Aryan Kashmir and Aryan Iran. Sadly one of the greatest Santoor players ever Pandit Bhajan Sopori passed away. He was a great musician and a great human-being proud of his pure Aryan lineage. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2603:7000:E300:8F00:D9BA:C2E2:6629:C246 (talk) 17:08, 2 June 2022 (UTC)

It is considered that the first civilization to be known as the Santaur was the Babylonians who embodied the Santaur in their historical epics such as the epic of Gilgamesh. And with numerals engraved on the Centaur machine. References 1- Aslani, Susan. "Female Santur Player". Santur Solois 2-"Oldest Santur Master that we have proof of". Master of the Santur 3-Khan, Hassan. "Santur Master". Old school Santur Master. 2001:8F8:1621:618:31DE:AD89:52A5:15D3 (talk) 20:45, 10 July 2020 (UTC)

Please do not play politics Santoor is native to Kashmir Valley. Ask the greatest Santoor master Pandit Bhajan Sopori of Sopore Kashmir. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.134.240.14 (talk) 23:52, 13 September 2014 (UTC)

The Jewish lobby for politics are making anything that is Indian as Persian and vice-versa to create a conflict between these two proud Aryan nations. Santoor has its origins in the Kashmir Valley, this is well documented. Santoor is believed to have the original Sanskrit name of "Shata Tantri Veena" and dates back to Vedic periods of Rigveda, approx 3-4 thousand years AD. "Shata" means hundred, "Tantri" means stringed and "Veena" was a generic name of all stringed instruments in sanskrit which is the oldest language known.

Shiv Kumar Sharma was a great Santoor player and born in Jammu on January 13, 1938. This truly Kashmiri origin instrument has giants in the Valley. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.134.98.31 (talk) 17:12, 30 August 2014 (UTC)

I started to wikify this and then realized that it sounds suspiciously like liner notes from a Shivkumar Sharma album. --LeeHunter 17:16, 28 Aug 2004 (UTC)

References

Proposed merger with Santur

All fake data placed by the Jews to create a break between kashmiris and Persians. Santoor is a instrument with origins in Kashmir (india0 and Persia. Both the instruments have differences. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.103.243.225 (talk) 19:26, 1 November 2012 (UTC)

Surely lot of lies. The Kashmiri Santoor originated in Kashmir and the family of the genuine Kashmiri Santoorist Pandit Bhajan Sopori had a great role in its development. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.88.88.203 (talk) 23:23, 6 June 2013 (UTC) I would agree the Jews being extremely insecure are often all over the media concocting things but they lack a credibility. The Santoor has her origins from Kashmir. the Jews do not like Iran and are busy trying to prop them up against other people. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.146.246.15 (talk) 16:15, 6 November 2012 (UTC)

The word translates to In ancient sanskrit texts, it has been referred to as Shatatantri vina (100-stringed vina, this its origin in Aryan Kashmir. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.176.3.186 (talk) 23:43, 18 August 2012 (UTC)

Sanskrit is an Aryan language indigenous to India and bordering areas of Central Asia did not arrive from any where but originated here. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.146.246.15 (talk) 13:27, 27 August 2012 (UTC)

Sanskrit is a member of the Indo-Iranian sub-family of the Indo-European family of languages. Its closest ancient relatives are the Iranian languages Old Persian and Avestan. In order to explain the common features shared by Sanskrit and other Indo-European languages, many scholars have proposed migration hypotheses asserting that the original speakers of what became Sanskrit arrived in what is now India and Pakistan from the north-west some time during the early second millennium BCE. --Opus88888 (talk) 03:35, 19 August 2012 (UTC)

The Santoor is an Aryan Kashmiri (Indian) instrument do not try to Semitize this by linking it to Mesopotamia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.146.246.15 (talk) 11:57, 12 August 2012 (UTC)

I a Hindu am married to a Jewish lady. My children of half-semitic and half Aryan. I shall try but it is impossibile to Semitize (make Jewish-Aran) Aryan India. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 4.28.128.194 (talk) 17:56, 15 August 2012 (UTC)

24.146.246.15 > The "terrible brahmin kid" from New York, master editor. --Opus88888 (talk) 04:24, 13 August 2012 (UTC)

The Santoor is native to Kashmir (India) and Iran. Some people to create a rift between the Indian and Iranian civilizations are often shifting things either way. The story of the Santoor from the genuine master Pandit Bhajan Sopori-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bS5WO_amIpQ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.88.88.174 (talk) 16:48, 20 October 2011 (UTC) The truth is Santoor is native to Kashmir and Iran. But as anticipated some insecure people (who are politically motivated) are trying to change its history as they are of other Indian things. The aim is to create a conflict between two ancient Aryan civilizations India and Iran. I don't think this article should be merged with santur. If anything, there should be a "Santur" article for the Persian santur (since the origin of the instrument is Persian), and maybe an "Indian santoor" (or santur or santour) for the currently named santoor article. The physical differences, playing styles, and famous musicians between the Persian and its derivative Indian santurs are different enough to merit different articles. --jonsafari 23:01, 14 October 2005 (UTC)

Right now both are covered in this longer article. I'll merge in the bit of text from Santur. If they are to be separate articles, that requires a lot more editing and writing work anyway, so I'm consolidating them for now. —Michael Z. 2005-10-16 14:58 Z

Wow. It's like you didn't even care what anyone thought about the proposed merge. You just stuck that merge proposal on the page for a day or two just to appear like you wanted to do things orderly, then went ahead with the merge no matter what. Unimpressive.

Also, since you seem to be unfamiliar with this topic, you might not be aware that the "santoor" (Indian) article appears to be a huge copyvio, thus negating your claims. --jonsafari 16:39, 16 October 2005 (UTC)

Sorry about that. I was responding to someone deleting all references to santur at santoor—it looked like they started to merge or differentiate the articles, but left it in an unfinished state. Since after reading it over in more detail, santoor seemed to be about both the Persian and derived Indian instruments, I rolled the few sentences here into that article. The two articles as they stand aren't about the two different instruments or versions. Since splitting the existing text would require substantial work whether it was to remain at one article or split into two, I thought this would be okay.

The copyvio was mentioned, but I have no way of verifying or denying it, so I decided to let others deal with it. Until a copyvio tag is placed on the page by someone who really knows, I'm not justified in doing anything about it. I'll just try to leave these alone for now, but folks, please don't just obliterate the connection between these obviously closely related instruments, and don't delete the merge tags without either merging or making these articles stand on their own. —Michael Z. 2005-10-16 17:51 Z

If a majority of the people vote to merge the two articles, then I have absolutely no problem with the merge. Either merging or splitting will both require substantial work, either way (much of which will probably be done by me or someone else knowledgeable in this field; not you). I just don't appreciate you merging so soon after putting up the merge tags, and without the majority being in support of the merge. If a majority support the merge, then fine, let's go ahead and start merging. Otherwise, just let it go.--jonsafari 00:48, 17 October 2005 (UTC)

This article randomly mixes descriptions of the Persian santur with the Indian, to the detriment of properly understanding either one. It would be better if split into two separate articles. Also, the difference of "santur" and "santoor" is no more than one of spelling, and either spelling may be used for the Indian or the Persian santur, and so doesn't properly serve to distinguish them.

I looked at the two pages Santur and Santoor but did not find any mention of Indian instrument. Shall we have to start a third page for this ancient Indian hundred-stringed instrument -- Shat-tantri Veena? It may perhaps be called Shantoor! Ghanonmatta 16:55, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

If the shata-tantri veena is sufficiently different from the santoor, and there's good references to verify the article, I don't see why not. –jonsafari 20:58, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

if the right spelling is "santur" then there should be an "Indian santur" article. and it should not be merged with article "santur" that is about the main Iranian origin of santur. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Karimi cae (talk • contribs) 16:10, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

I don't know much about either instrument, but I have to say that if there is any difference in playing style, the instrument itself, origins, and/or philosophy behind the instrument, then the articles should be separate. For instance it is like calling a viola and a violin the same thing. Most people don't see a difference, but the violin is slightly smaller. They deserve to be seen as different instruments. :::::: —Preceding unsigned comment added by 41.132.227.34 (talk) 18:27, 22 January 2011 (UTC)

wrong information

While going by your information i saw that it has been mentioned that sh. ulhas bapat introduced chromatic ttuning on santoor. may i mention here that Sh. shaukat Ahmed from kashmir. at the same time the great sufiyana ustad also played similarly. may this be corrected. (Arifchisti 05:42, 18 August 2007 (UTC))

link deleted

hi. i carried out a minor edit, removal of a link to santoor lessons in California, USA. it appeared to me to be an advertisement, rather than in the nature of "information" per se. just to keep everyone informed. cheers (procrasty 19:04, 24 November 2011 (UTC))

Iranian

Originally from Kashmir (India) Iranians also have one of their own. Great player of this instrument is Pandit Bhajan Sopori — Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.176.188.179 (talk) 08:12, 23 January 2013 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 19 February 2014

Please add Madan Oak as a Santoor Player.

here is his information.

Madan Oak is a disciple of the world-renowned Santoor Maestro Padma Vibhushan Pandit Shivkumar Sharma. He has been studying Indian classical music for over 25 years. He has won several college and University level awards in Classical music competitions and is recipient of the 1986 All India Radio (AIR) Best Instrumentalist National award. He was felicitated with a “Kala-Gaurav” award in December 2012 in Pune, India.

He has given many concerts in USA, UK, Switzerland, India, Dubai and Abu Dhabi and on the All India Radio Pune Station on several occasions. Apart from playing Santoor, he is also a gifted light music vocalist and is also involved in promoting Indian classical music. He has headed several Indian organizations.

Living in America for more than 21 years leading in IT Business, Madan has been featured on TV programs, various venues like IndiaFest-99, India Association of Southeast Texas, Lata Mangeshkar Foundation, Bay Area Maharashtra Mandal, Basant Bahar 2003 / 2012,San Francisco World Music Festival 2003, local public Channel KMVT-15, Brihan Maharashtra Mandal 2005 / 2007 and many more.

Madan released his first classical music album on July 31st, 2010 at the hands of the respected Veena Sahastrabuddhe, a highly regarded Indian classical music vocalist. The name of the album is "Moonlit Strings", the album contents classical raga Rageshri presented by Madan on Santoor accompanied by Abhiman Kaushal on Tabla. This album is available for purchase on iTunes for download or from Madan's website for his academy www.shatatantri.com. The album was blessed and endorsed by his Guru Pt. Shivkumar Sharma.

To give exposure of Indian classical Music and Dance to local bay area California children, Madan started an academy of Indian classical music and dance by the name of Shatatantri Media in 2006, where students get an opportunity to learn Indian music and dances from well known musicians and teachers. The academy is affiliated with Gandharva Mahavidyalaya of India and conducts Indian classical music certification examinations. Freeworld07 (talk) 18:55, 19 February 2014 (UTC)

 Not done You need to cite reliable sources to back up your request, without which no information should be added to any article. - Arjayay (talk) 19:04, 19 February 2014 (UTC)

article description

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Semi-protected edit request on 15 October 2022

 Not done for now: They must be notable and have an article on Wikipedia to be included. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 19:03, 15 October 2022 (UTC)

Notable players

• Ulhas Bapat (1950–2018)
• Tarun Bhattacharya (b. 1957)
• Rahul Sharma (b. 1972)
• Shivkumar Sharma (1938–2022)
• Madan Oak (born 1963)
• Abhay Sopori
• Bhajan Sopori (1948-2022)
• R. Visweswaran (1944–2007)
• Varsha Agrawal (b. 1967)
• Mohammad Tibet Baqal (1914–1982)
• Harjinder Pal Singh (b. 1953)
• Madan Oak (California USA) (b. 1963) Bharatiyasangeet (talk) 03:02, 15 October 2022 (UTC)

References