Talk:Percival

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 27 August 2018 and 12 December 2018. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Liam Day213. Peer reviewers: Mpohlman2000.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 06:23, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

Spelling differences

The spelling seems to be a matter of cultural-linguistic bias. The legend's oldest form is probably Celtic, so the Welsh "Peredur" is probably closest to the original. The various French spellings are more recognizable to most, excluding Germanophiles and Wagner fans, who would prefer "Parzival". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.65.188.132 (talk • contribs)

Rohmer film, Monaco novels

It looks like there is resistance to the changes recently made, which removed some information left uncited for more than 8 months (to whit, the Rohmer film) and the inclusion of Richard Monaco's Arthurian cycle books that center on the character. As there were four books in the cycle published in the mass market, I think that makes their notability intrinsic; that they focus on the subject of the article makes it ever more so. I am not against re-adding the Rohmer film information, so long as reliable citation accompanies it. - Arcayne (^{cast a spell}) 20:46, 19 June 2008 (UTC)

As to Rohmer's film, it is well known, and nothing said about it is controversial, it's essentially tautology. It looks like the tag was just misplaced, though there are plenty of secondary sources on this. I had never heard of Monaco's book and was initially skeptical, but after looking him up in the New Arthurian Encyclopedia, it appears to be real and fairly well known. I'm always wary of sections where we just list off modern work that involve the subject of the article without context; I suggest just adding the ones that have been discussed in secondary sources.--Cúchullain ^t/c 20:58, 19 June 2008 (UTC)

First of all thanks for 'improving my word power', as I was unaware of the term tautology. If I don't learn something new from Wikipedia every time I visit, I feel cheated. I don't feel cheated today.:)

Secondly, I share your skepticism of lists of modern references of subject material; too many Elric pop references that bear little in the way of connection clutter up the Elric of Melniboné article have helped to form my opinion on the subject. I am not suggesting that Rohmer's film is being challenged on validity or controversy grounds, but rather to provide a reference point for someone actually using WP as a research source. As the film is well-known, there are likely many solid references that can add to the statement to further ground the encyclopedic value of the statement, and thusly the article.

I am unfamiliar with the New Arthurian Encyclopedia, though it sounds like a wealth of citable information. - Arcayne (^{cast a spell}) 21:05, 19 June 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, the NAE is pretty awesome. I've added the requested cite. Do you have one for the Monaco novel? It's even more important there, as there is currently no Wikipedia article for readers to turn to for sources.--Cúchullain ^t/c 21:12, 19 June 2008 (UTC)

The only reference I could quickly find is that from Amazon, whic notes an editorial from the Salisbury Times. Can't seem to find the Salisbury Times, though - it might have been gobbled up on the media wars of a few years ago. I remember reading it as a boy and remember really liking it. It turned me on to Malory's considerably denser work. - Arcayne (^{cast a spell}) 17:25, 20 June 2008 (UTC)

Well, as soon as you find a reference put it up there.--Cúchullain ^t/c 16:55, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

Absolutely, and as you said that something about it popped up in the New Arthuran E, could you add a citation from there? Should I use the Amazon one for the time being? - Arcayne (^{cast a spell}) 17:00, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

Oh yes, I'll add it right away. I think the NAE cite should be sufficient.--Cúchullain ^t/c 19:27, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

Splendid. That link, olus the Amazon one should alleviate any concerns that might arise. Cheers! - Arcayne (^{cast a spell}) 20:01, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

A clear error exists in the following item under the "Modern Interpretations" section: "As well, Gerald Morris's series of four novels based on the Arthurian Grail Quest of Percival, beginning with Parsival or a Knight's Tale, is a re-telling of the Percival legend". Richard Monaco is the author for this series, not Gerald Morris. The citation appears correct though. I'm unfamiliar with Morris' actual work, but it does not appear germane to the subject material, so I would recommend his name be removed altogether. I have not directly edited articles so I'm submitting this in hopes that someone will fix this error. (On another note, I think there should be a Richard Monaco wiki page but it appears to have been deleted --Evanaclark (talk) 09:37, 5 March 2011 (UTC)

A bullet list style random works that I removed - not-protagonist, not influential, and lacking cited third-party commentary

On the BBC television series Merlin, Percival is a large, strong commoner. After helping to free Camelot from the occupation of Morgana, Morgause, and their immortal army (which is supplied by a grail-like goblet called the Cup of Life), he is knighted along with Lancelot, Elyan and Gwaine, against the common practice that knights are only of noble birth. He is also one of the few Round Table knights to survive Arthur's death.

In the comic books based on the television series Gargoyles, Peredur fab Ragnal (Percival's Welsh name) achieves the Holy Grail and becomes the Fisher King. To honor his mentor, Arthur, he establishes a secret order who will guide the world to greater prosperity and progress, which eventually becomes the Illuminati. Part of achieving the Holy Grail is the bestowal of immense longevity - bordering on immortality - upon Peredur and his wife, Fleur (born as "Blanchefleur"), along with certain other members of the order being granted longer lifespans. He is still alive and even appears young by 1996, when his organization comes into conflict with the re-awakened Arthur and the other characters of the Gargoyles story.

A version of Percival appears in Season 5 of the American TV series Once Upon A Time in which he acts against Regina without Arthur's consent.

Patricia A. McKillip's 2016 novel Kingfisher includes many elements of the story of Percival and the Fisher King. Young Pierce (Percival meaning "pierce the valley"), after a chance meeting with knights leaves his mother, who has sheltered him from the world, and travels to become a knight. In chapter 3 he stays a night at the Kingfisher Inn, where there is an unusual procession preceding the evening meal involving a bleeding gaff, an old cauldron and a chandelier. Pierce also fails to ask a question and in the morning wakes to find no-one around and steals a magical knife.

In Philip Reeve's Here Lies Arthur, he appear as Peredur, son of Peredur Long-knife, who is raised as a woman by his mother, who had already lost many sons and her husband to war. He befriends the main character, Gwyna/Gwyn. He is one of the few major characters to survive to the end, and travels with Gwen (in a male disguise) as 'Peri', his childhood shortened name as a woman, playing a harp to Gwen's stories.

--94.246.150.68 (talk) 16:10, 16 October 2017 (UTC)

Also removed: the novel and film The Natural. and the movie Excalibur. --94.246.150.68 (talk) 16:22, 16 October 2017 (UTC)

References

Perceval probably should be the article name

Percival being only one English form. Now I know it's an English Wikipedia, but he's primarily a French literature character (historically) and not rarely he appeared as Perceval also in English. 5.173.105.90 (talk) 02:35, 30 December 2022 (UTC)